US Election & Presidency

(16-02-2018 19:06 )Chunter Wrote:  

(16-02-2018 13:20 )babelover48 Wrote:  so he knows how to negotiate does he?

And that's just the top 5...

you mean....there's MORE??

Streaking in a game of American Football and tampering with the democratic process of another sovereign nation are a little bit different

Yes they allegedly tried that is the point of the investigation to confirm whether or not the alleged interference is genuine, that is the point of every investigation since the dawn of time and every investigation until the end of it. Even if they did only try without success that should not let them off the hook, attempt is a crime of itself for several offences including murder, manslaughter and rape. I think attempted hacking of the Election to the Head of State of another Sovereign Nation would be a justifiable charge and covinction

(16-02-2018 19:12 )HannahsPet Wrote:  13 russian indicted by Muller for Meddling in US election

I won't be visiting them in prison...

What's that, Skippy? They won't be going to prison? Well, really...

(16-02-2018 15:19 )Doddle Wrote:  .Not... THEM!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAARGHHHHHH!!

And you're telling other people to grow up?

(16-02-2018 15:19 )Doddle Wrote:  All evidence of history suggests they won't be stopped, however hard you try.

Your defeatist attitude is ridiculous. It's like saying some people will always break the law so it's not worth trying to stop them. Or, if you want to be topical, people will always find a way to take an assault rifle into a school...

(16-02-2018 15:19 )Doddle Wrote:  Usually because the truly terrible people are often welcomed by masses of the people who evidentially support them, like it or not.

Not to mention the cases where supposedly nice people get elected and carry out some of the worst stuff.

If the election was fair and above board, without outside interference, then that's the way it goes, and everyone has to deal with the consequences. Just like Brexit.

(16-02-2018 15:19 )Doddle Wrote:  Trump was elected by the same sorts of people who wanted Reagan and Bush II. There are lots of them in America. They don't need Russian help. The Russians will know that.

There aren't enough 'diehards' on either side to elect anyone. All candidates need the swing voters, the ones who are open to persuasion, to cross the winning line. These are the people the campaigns are aimed at, and they will be the ones the Russians will target.

(16-02-2018 15:19 )Doddle Wrote:  

Quote:A better analogy for you would be - hearing someone trying to jemmy your back door in and thinking "I'll just turn the telly up and worry about it if they actually manage to get in"

Not really. A better analogy might be is if two people running round a track, one gets bumped or harassed by spectators alongside.

The analogy wasn't about the alleged interference, it was about your attitude to it.

(16-02-2018 19:49 )babelover48 Wrote:  

(16-02-2018 19:06 )Chunter Wrote:  And that's just the top 5...

you mean....there's MORE??

Trump University lost it's appeal the other day, against the $25million law suit brought by former students.

Looks like they'll have to pay up.

I would agree that Trump's tweet that Russian interference started in 2014 before his campaign isn't really that clever.

(16-02-2018 22:39 )The Silent Majority Wrote:  

(16-02-2018 15:19 )Doddle Wrote:  .Not... THEM!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAARGHHHHHH!!

And you're telling other people to grow up?

Show me where I told other people to grow up

(16-02-2018 09:40 )Doddle Wrote:  The Russians TRIED (allegedly) to interfere with the result, but it can't even be proved that this cause had an effect - and this is the end of the world as far as these people are concerned. Shouldn't they just grow up?

(16-02-2018 09:40 )Doddle Wrote:  If a streaker ran on the pitch in the middle of the Superbowl, and the losing team then went "oh well, the streaker was in league with the other side", I'd think that was pathetic too.

Fine, I'll take the analogy as given.

That there was a streaker on the field shouldn't over-turn the result and the losing team shouldn't cry foul because of it. I get that.

But that's not really what's happening here.

It's more like the losing team saying, "win or lose, we have to stop pitch invasions by naked blokes! It's bad for the game and someone, one day, will get hurt."

And the winning team says, "naked bloke? What naked bloke? We didn't see any streaker. You're just sore losers!"

(16-02-2018 23:29 )The Silent Majority Wrote:  

(16-02-2018 09:40 )Doddle Wrote:  The Russians TRIED (allegedly) to interfere with the result, but it can't even be proved that this cause had an effect - and this is the end of the world as far as these people are concerned. Shouldn't they just grow up?

Whoops

I am happy to agree that attempted crime is a bad thing. Attempted rape, attempted murder, attempts to pervert the course of justice...

However, I find "attempting to sway a democratic contest" less serious because it happens every day of every week etc by all sorts of organisations. To single out any one seems a colossal waste of time, and to claim it was for criminal ends is really going too far. Let alone "we're making a big fuss now to warn off even more reprehensible scum who might try harder next time". Just seems to be missing the wood for the trees.

But hey

It may go on all the time within a nation but for a foreign power to seek to subvert the democratic process is “an act of war” (this term has been used by officials in the US) . Now remember Trump has repeatedly said he didn’t believe the Russians did anything. If any of his team had any contact with the indicted Russians then I can see a treason charge following.