Europe, Referendum & Brexit (formerly Europe..IN or OUT??)

(08-09-2019 06:00 )babelover48 Wrote:  ^I would agree mate, but I think let the EU tell us to fuck off and fuck off we do so. We stop entering Eurovision automatically (so we save money on sending singers abroad for it), we stop sending money to them automatically.
If they come knocking on our door asking us to come back we should tell them to fuck off and charge their airlines in using our airspace.

if eurovision is the EU why is russia and israel in it

maybe we should leave uefa as well

in fact everything with a euro in it we should leave

^this is the core issue for me. so many 'leavers' don't even know what the eu is or what it does.

there should never have been a fuckin referendum. our elected politicians should decide. and we all know what the majority of them want to do. we elect them to make the difficult decisions for us. i say let them do their job.

I voted leave, but now seeing the actual situation and all the lies Johnson and Farage peddled during the campaign, i would now vote remain. A no deal would light up the Irish troubles again, and this wasn't given any air time during the campaign. Our politicians fucked up badly, Cameron was so sure remain would win. Another referendum, and the leavers will cry about democracy, but the path just now leads to the cliff edge.

It was just last week Amber was delighted to be in Johnson's cabinet. Wonder if Johnson chanced her

(08-09-2019 06:36 )SecretAgent Wrote:  ^ Eurovision has nothing to do with being an EU member. Pretty sure you’ve been told this before

Yes he's told before.

Just for the record, 42 countries entered Eurovision this year and only 25 of them were members of the EU. 3 members of the EU didn't enter.

The UK first entered Eurovision in 1957 and joined the EU in 1973.

(08-09-2019 09:49 )terence Wrote:  ^this is the core issue for me. so many 'leavers' don't even know what the eu is or what it does.

there should never have been a fuckin referendum. our elected politicians should decide. and we all know what the majority of them want to do. we elect them to make the difficult decisions for us. i say let them do their job.

Absolutely.

It also bugs me that whenever this point is made in Parliament, the papers or on television, there is a resounding groan of indignation as if acknowledging this fact -- and it is a fact -- is to somehow insult the intelligence of everyone who voted leave.

What is wrong with admitting that Brexit is a frightfully complex issue and that we are busy people with jobs and families and social lives and babeshows to cap and comment on? We can only ever skim the surface. We can only see the tip of the iceberg and have to trust our politicians to fully investigate what's under the waterline.

I don't have a PhD in economics and following the minutiae of this debate is not my job. So I'm expected to make sense of a deeply complex issue from snippets of statements that I see on the news and social media, all of which -- as a responsible consumer of 'news' -- I have to try to interpret through the prism of the biases of the people posting them.

The truth is that none of us (myself included) really knew what we were voting for -- Brexit was just a fractured mirror of ourselves. It was a ludicrous question to take to the public and now -- ironically -- the only way out of this mess might be to take it to the public a second time, in the vain hope that two wrongs might make it right.

Our entire country has degenerated into the hackneyed plot of a 1980's sitcom. In 2016, we were knocked on the head and we collectively lost our minds. Another knock on the head might put us right and put a merciful end to this rotten show.

So we have Raab saying the Govt will test the new law to it’s limit. Johnson saying he won’t ask for an extension. Unnamed sources saying the Govt will break the rules of the EU to get thrown out if necessary. Meanwhile other Ministers say they will resign if Johnson does not obey the law.

If he does break the law he will be taken to court and if a judge orders him to obey and he does not then he will be jailed for contempt of court.

What happened to the Conservatives being the party of law & order?

What value the sovereignty of UK parliament so lorded by brexiteers if the first time it's tested under a 'true believer' PM he threatens to disregard the very laws of the land it has put in place? If he can pursue this course so contemptously, doesn't this imply one of the supposed tenants of Brexit was little more than a smokescreen for at least one of its main founders?

It appears that the 'Rebel Alliance' had sounded out the EU to see if a delay was possible for 3 months before they passed the No Deal Brexit bill.

(08-09-2019 18:13 )Charlemagne Wrote:  It appears that the 'Rebel Alliance' had sounded out the EU to see if a delay was possible for 3 months before they passed the No Deal Brexit bill.

Its almost as if they knew what they were doing Novel idea