scottish footy

What the fuck have I started lol i'm a man u fan and i think that the gap between us and the old firm is huge, celtic i think would be about 7 or 8th in england, rangers would be lucky to stay up

lol you can run but you can't hide lol

Hi, all. Thought I'd wade in with my two'pennorth. I'm late to the thread as I've been offline for a couple of days 'cos of some building work going on, but having read all four pages I think most opinions have been covered except my very controversial one. (takes deep breath...)

If Celtic and Rangers joined the EPL right now they would go down in their first season. Bearing in mind the massive fan base of both clubs, they would get back fairly quickly considering that most of the players at both clubs are decent Championship level players like Caldwell of Celtic or Ferguson at Rangers, however the gulf in overall quality between the SPL and EPL is just that, a gulf. I lived in Scotland a while ago and used to go to Tynecastle to watch Hearts. The two best players at the time were McCann on the left and Johnston on the right and neither of those two were high enough quality for the EPL. I watched most of the SPL, excepting the Old Firm and Hibs (two sets of matches that can contain a little too much heat for a displaced sassinak, for different reasons) and the quality was honestly no higher than I could have seen in the old second and third divisions. (league one and two these days)

I don't say this as a patronizing Englishman, I hope you understand that. The same problems plague every league from countries with small populations. Watching Hearts vs Kilmarnock the quality on display is no better or worse than watching than Liera vs Braga (Portugal) or Fortuna vs Sparta (Holland). In Scotland, just like Portugal or Holland, talent and money are sucked in to two or three clubs in the major population centres. Countries like England, Spain, Italy, Germany and France have ten or more times the population, meaning ten or more times higher attendance and a gulf in earning potential of similar magnitude. When the game is so dominated by money, small clubs in less than glamorous leagues can't compete with even medium sized clubs from the bigger leagues.

So to sum up what I've rambled on about.. Overall quality of the Scottish League? Very poor, an unavoidable circumstance in the era of corporate football, sorry if I've offended any Scots. How would Rangers and Celtic fare in the EPL? Very poorly at first without massive investment in new players. Given enough time both clubs would eventually rise to the upper levels of the league, but would need sugar-daddies to do it in the 2-5 years suggested earlier. A one off cup tie in Europe bears no resemblance to the three game a week grind of the League and Cup competitions. Do the Old Firm have decent records against the top english clubs in UEFA competitions? Yes, but in cup games anything can happen. Just ask Burnley's fans. Does that mean the Old Firm could compete successfully in the EPL? No more than Burnley or any other giant killing Championship team. Once again, sorry if I've offended anyone.

Just out of interest...I wonder how many of the people who've viewed this thread were actually Foot fetishists and were really disappointed when they realised it meant scottish football and not scottish feet !

astonv1 Wrote:Just out of interest...I wonder how many of the people who've viewed this thread were actually Foot fetishists and were really disappointed when they realised it meant scottish football and not scottish feet !

Quality post! I'd just like to say I'm from England and posted on the first page! Also,slightly off topic but mentioned here,the hatred of the English national side by the other home countries always irked me. As an Englishman I have always supported Wales,Scotland,Northern Ireland and even Eire when they play internationals not involving England after all the British style of football has always been the best to watch! But then I'm a Tottenham fan and don't hate Arsenal,I don't like them but that's because of how few British players there are in their first team but I suppose that's just me. Anyway enough rambling,let the debate continue!

Dreamlander

Mr Gummidge. Finally you have posted in here. I know you are an impartial man and have looked forward to reading your response all day. The reason why? Because I knew you would hit the nail right on the head! I share the exact same opinion and I honestly believe that anyone who disagrees is wrong. Theres no convincing the Celtic fans but I suppose thats natural for them to believe in their club.

By the way, it's nice to hear you were a regular visitor to Tynecastle..... you can't beat the smell of the brewery on a Saturday afternoon

Oh, make no mistake Jordo, I believe in both Old Firm clubs as well. I just don't believe in either Old Firm team as they stand right now. Go back twenty years and I think the Old Firm, Aberdeen and both major Edinburgh clubs would have fared pretty well in the English top flight. Rangers especially may even have had the quality to win it back then, but the past twenty years have been very, very hard on Scottish football as a whole and the domestic setup in particular has suffered from lack of investment. I think Scottish fans need to realise that the glory days of the SPL are gone and focus their non-domestic hopes on the national side. A small population has never hurt Portugal or Holland and with the right investment in the coaching of young players Scotland can still be a force internationally. Yes, I really do believe that! Under Smith, McLeish and now Burley things are definitley moving in the right direction.

As for Hearts, Romanov's a complete scumbucket. The Jammies were THIS CLOSE to breaking the monopoly for the first time in god knows how long and he goes and completely screws the whole thing up. Tosspot!

bree Wrote:the old firm got in to the premier league it would take about 2/5 years for us to win the English Premier League.

This made me laugh, thanks for brightening up my day. Seriously, I can only assume that the '2/5' was a typo and you meant 25 years. That's still ambitious though considering it would take the Old Firm around 12 seasons to work their way up from the very bottom of the English leagues. As that is were they should be made to start if they want to change leagues. Unless they can come up with a suitable compensation package for every single club that they jump over to start in the Premiership.

bree Wrote:no joke i do think that iam a Celtic fan and not a BIGOT being going to games for 15 years now

I don't understand this. You'd think that after 15 years you would be pretty sure you would be a Celtic supporter. You may not be a bigot but the clubs themselves thrive on bigotry and have no interest in stopping it, otherwise they would have rooted it out by now.

bree Wrote:stop watch teams like Dunfermline and Stirling Albion and come and watch a good team like celtic

I have had the misfortune to see Celtic, it was at East End Park season 03/04 (the season after Celtic bottled it at Killie / Dunfermline rolled over for Rangers, take your pick of which one is applicable). A large group of Celtic fans gathered at a fence near an entrance to the ground to throw stones and bottles at Dunfermline fans entering the ground. I also believe some of choicer terms directed at us would have counted as bigotry. I also had the misfortune to visit Ibrox for an Old Firm derby. 15 minutes in and after the 3rd rousing course of "we're upto our knees in Fenian blood" from considerably more than a small minority I left ground. On my way out I asked a steward why nothing was being done, and was told "to go and fuck yourself you dirty tim".

bree Wrote:the spl is a much better league than the Irish league

Granted I probably over exaggerated in my original post. Irish football is generally piss poor, but I still believe the likes of Linfield and Glentoran would be in and around the bottom half of the SPL or top of the first.

astonv1 Wrote:Just out of interest...I wonder how many of the people who've viewed this thread were actually Foot fetishists and were really disappointed when they realised it meant scottish football and not scottish feet !

Fantastic. LOL

All you need to do is look at the performances of players who have played in both leagues..let's pick a few at random...

1. Barry Ferguson - looked great when he was first at Rangers, got found out as slow and ineffective when Souness paid silly money to bring him to Blackburn

2. Jean Alain Boumsong - looked like a world-beater at Rangers, was a total pile of shit that lacked any composure when at Newcastle, another favour to Rangers from Souness

3. Samaras (cant remember his first name) - was a useless goofy striker at Man City but is a prolific goofy striker at Celtic