Now here's a problem for you computer genii

Okay, now I've had my evil streak of fun... for now (in public anyway)
In response to some of the posts. This might get at little long...

snakeeyes02 Wrote:Hi Just a few suggestions
1. have you Tried to Fix by restoring to a previous point By Pressing n holding F8 when Windows logo appears It will take you to a black screen scroll down to restore to last working point.

2. Unistall in safe mode Using same technigue above just choose safe mode

3. Try a different Usb port Might be a IRQ Conflict.

1. Bit pointless, the option is actuall LKGC (Last Known Good Configuration) and is of occasional use when an NT based OS isn't booting as all it does is attempt to roll the OS back to the last time it thinks it loaded

2. No use at all, if something has be 'uninstalled' properly in windows then uninstalling in safe mode won't achieve anything more. I say 'uninstalled' as all removing something in device manager does is reforce the device to redetect, it doesn't actaully uninstall any files

3. Trying a different port is of some use (although I'd have specified making sure it was not of the same pair so it was using a different hub). Moving it to a different USB socket however has absolutely zilch effect on IRQ allocation though. IRQs are not used by USB devices, the IRQ is assigned to the controller, which then is linked to the hub, which in turn the ports are attached to so IRQ allocation is quite a few levels away from the devices

snakeeyes02 Wrote:Just curious did you turn ur computer off before unplugging the usb ? If you didnt you then have to check for hadware changes and it will find the new device and install drivers

USB is plug and play. There were a handful of idiosyncratic devices when USB initially came out that didn't do this correctly but otherwise you don't need to turn things off to detect via this standard (note I said detect not install)

chrislatimer Wrote:is it plug and play or did you have to install it

Often confused but the two things are not opposites. Plug and play effectively means it can be hot plugged. All hardware requires installing drivers at some level. Whether those drivers are part of the OS is the factor that defines how simple things are and if software needs to be installed prior or post connection (with contemporary USB devices drivers are normally installed prior to connection if required seperately)

snakeeyes02 Wrote:Try plugging somethink else into the usb port. like a wired mouse or keyboard IF windows finds them then you know that it is not the usb ports The it is either a driver issue or faulty hardware if its hardware then if its still under manufacturers warrantee take it back
and get a replacement.

I'd adjust that and say possibly the hardware. Depending on the other hardware connected you still haven't eliminated drivers, power usage off the USB hub and USB mode settings

My tuppence? From what has been suggested, and from what I can infer presuming everything that has been done has been done correctly there are a few things it could possibly be. I'll try to summarize:

1. Faulty keyboard reporting incorrect device information via the dongle

2. Faulty chipset drivers that drive the USB controllers, less likely as other devices work but the issue with the external HDD could also be caused by this so can't be fully ruled out

3. Insufficient power supplied to the USB sockets, again unlikely but without asking you to check the power drain on the USB hubs by the devices attached it is still a possibility

4. Keyboards pull standard drivers from the OS normally, however some have custom functions. Mostly these keyboards will still have basic functionality and detect correctly without them however not always and HP used to be a pain in the arse for this with some of their keyboards and this might explain why it didn't work on another unit as well so check for any keyboard driver/utility software on their site. No I'm not checking for you

5. Another device plugged into the other half of the pairing. Only come across this a few times as most manufaturers design their devices within a certain size if they plug direct to USB without a cable but sometimes some devices paired up if too wide can cause one or both devices not to seat correctly. I know you've said you've tried another socket but you haven't specified how so still a possible 100-1 three-legged horse chance

As a closing point concerning the HDD issue. Some PCs come with only so many USB2 ports the others being USB1 (or more accurately 1.1) Some devices will report back to warn of slow performance if not connected to a USB2 socket configure correctly or just a plain USB1 socket. If you're sure it's a USB2 socket it's on as well as checking the chipset drivers mentioned above then more than a few machines have the option of switching between USB2 fast/hi-speed and full mode in the BIOS. Ironically USB2 fast is the slower speed and is effectively USB1.1 and might be why the HDD is complaining (this won't be why the keyboard isn't working as it is a low speed device so doesn't mind either mode)

PS. Thumbs up to the Worzel As always some sanity. Yes I could take you flitting through the registry (although for this issue it isn't required) However I will not as it isn't worth my time picking up the pieces when somebody does something wrong and wonders why things stop working and can't say what they did and didn't export the settings first as a backup

I'm happy to flit through certain chunks of the registry myself, with some people who are attentive I might do the occasional thing live on the phone as guidance so I can make sure they are looking at the right bit. Here... unlikely unless extremely simpleand always at own risk

BTW if anybody asks. No I'm not technical... I have a life

Thanks for that Red. Just a quick note on the hdd, I get the same massage whatever usb port I put it in, all being usb 2. The other external, same make, is fine.

Like I say, if I put the power lead only in and let it power up/warm up, then put the usb lead it, it's fine. If I turn it on with usb lead connected, you can here it powering up then there's quite a noticeable loud click and it seems to power up again, after this click I get the message.

Strange.

the thing is that a lot of cheaper lappys power 2 usbs off the same internal plug so even with a 2-1 plug your still under powering the hdd, you really need to connect the 2 usb plugs into independant usb hubs. say 1 on the side and another on the back this way you should get all the power your hdd needs. if you have win 7 you can check the outputs of the usb ports via they system tab in control pannel.
alos just because a drive claims to be the same make it doesnt necessarily mean the exact same model
my 2x1tb samsung spinpoint f3's are similar (same make and model) but they have different firmware and are slight differences on the pcb. there capacity is the same as is the speed and cache size but as i say there are slight differences between the 2

Inetersting codex.


I disembowelled the dongle and took the black plastic coat off, then I shoved it back in the usb port. I noticed a very slight flicker of blue light, wiggled it a bit and it flickered a bit more, so there's slight life there. Which gives credence to the under powered USB port.

May also explain the external hdd.

er, but what could that mean?

I do have a separate usb 2,0 converter thing with it's own plug supply, I will try it in that tomorrow.

(02-10-2010 04:34 )HEX!T Wrote:  if you have win 7 you can check the outputs of the usb ports via they system tab in control pannel.

Thats handy. I'm thinking of upping, Vistas has always been fine for me though.

http://www.spunkyjones.com/computer-usb-...erpowered/

Specifically:

Quote:In a Windows Vista System, starting from the control panel, right-click the device manager and open it. Now, double-click on Universal Serial Bus Controllers, right-click the USB Hub you wish to review, and select properties, and then open the power tab. The power tab will show a detailed listing of how much power is in use for that USB port and/or the attached devices are using.

http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/usb_devices_view.html

are you sure you have a life red that seemed quite knowledgable

(03-10-2010 03:31 )loulo12 Wrote:  Inetersting codex.


I disembowelled the dongle and took the black plastic coat off, then I shoved it back in the usb port. I noticed a very slight flicker of blue light, wiggled it a bit and it flickered a bit more, so there's slight life there. Which gives credence to the under powered USB port.

Actually that gives credance to the dongle being broken (or the socket but you've already elimiated that, haven't you? )

Power drain by a wireless keyboard and mouse shouldn't be and issue unless it is paired with a high power drain device on the same hub as they are low power devices. Your external HDD will be high power unless is has it's own power source, as were some original USB printers back in the day and USB modems

As for cheaper laptops sharing power across 2 ports. This is normal, the USB hub on a computer ALWAYS powers two sockets. Whether those two sockets are external, internal (webcams and wifi/bluetooth normally) or not connected to anything is another matter though

Oh and yes, I still have a life, which is one of the reasons I let you lot ask and answer first as trying to fill in all the blanks without typing a saga covering all the if, whats and maybes would take too long

you misunderstand what im saying red and not all lappys run 2 ports off 1 motherboard socket. some run more. i know of a few high cost 1s that use 1 port per motherboard connector...
im thinking if he has powered a high drain usb device via 2 ports from the same motherboard connector it may have damaged the motherboard connector. leading to unstable current. normaly this can be seen with crc errors oh external usb powerd hdds...

as for wiggling the dongle and getting a light then it sounds like a mechanical fault. either an expanded usb or broken connector.

Doesn't work now, sat on it and broke.